Return to Unfiction unforum
 a.r.g.b.b 
 Calendar Calendar   FAQ FAQ   Search Search   Memberlist Memberlist   Usergroups Usergroups 
 Register Register   Log in Log in 
 
Welcome!
New users, PLEASE read these forum guidelines. New posters, SEARCH before posting and read these rules before posting your killer new campaign. New players may also wish to peruse the ARG Player Tutorial.

All users must abide by the Terms of Service.
This week sponsored by:

You?

Why do we need your help?
Announcements
Your continued support keeps uF running!
 
The time now is Fri Dec 19, 2014 10:21 am
All times are UTC - 4 (DST in action)
View posts in this forum since last visit
View unanswered posts in this forum
Calendar
 Forum index » Archive » Archive: General » ARG: Find the Lost Ring
[BEIJING]The 5 + 1
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topicMark the topic unreadView next topic
Page 1 of 3 [37 Posts]   Goto page: 1, 2, 3 Next
Author Message
Tenchizard
Decorated


Joined: 22 Sep 2007
Posts: 254

[BEIJING]The 5 + 1
Another part of the Sixth Ring message

Seeing as we are trying to separate our tasks so we can work on them easily, I guess I'll open this thread to hear more theories about this subject. We are more or less sure that 5+1 means our six athletes, but still we have no real clue as what thay may mean for the final labyrinth.

We suggested that maybe 5 athletes could travel, and 1 athlete would remain here. We also suggested that the 5 travellers should be at the "monumental wave", while the other one should be running the labyrinths.

We also mentioned the theory that 1 of the Six won't "go back" because he(or she) never left. If that's the case, we should try to figure out which one of the Six is from our own world, and why did he lost his memory even if he didn't travel.
I've been speaking to Jasper right now, and we feel that for the travellers to come to this world, there should have been something that took them here, just as we will use a flare during the closing ceremonies to send them home. Maybe one of the Six, the one whose home world is this one, did some special labyrinth to act as a beacon so the travellers knew WHERE they had to go. And maybe that labyrinth erased the beacon's memory, but that's all just a theory and I don't really know if it could be even proved.

Last night Eli said we might be close to what the 5+1 means, but... there must be something we are not seeing... what else is there for us to see?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 7:30 am
Last edited by Tenchizard on Mon Aug 11, 2008 5:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
jasper
Unfettered


Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 560
Location: Texas

Reading through the transcript, I notice that Eli starts to steer the conversation towards the idea that 5 return while 1 remains, but then backs off from that idea and says we just don't know, and need to think about it more.

The easiest answer seems like: 5 return home (by being on the monumental wave) and one remains (because that one is opening the door with the 11 circuit dance which can't be done on the wave.)

I'm attracted to the idea that one traveler who is from this world doesn't need to travel from the wave because he or she is already in the world-type where he or she belongs. Maybe that person doesn't need to travel, but just needs to sort of find him or herself: not literally find a parallel self, but synchronize enough to recognize their place in this world.

What I was discussing with Tenchizard- how the 6 came here and not somewhere else- what beacon brought them here: is that a codex question? I mean, has it been answered?

Anyway, I think 5 and 1 is something that happened in 2004 as well, only the other way around. 5 remained and 1 left? We might need more info about that year. I tried to pluck out what Eli said about it from the transcript.

Quote:
    We were able to send one runner home in 2004.
    Despite the fact that our omphalos network was not complete.
    It is difficult to listen to the team in San Francisco and read everyone in chat at the same time!
    Yes, we had a very weak strength in 2004, as there were hardly any agonothetai.


    Toria traveled from Delphi.
    Which was my best guess for a portal. But I did not have the sixth ring then.
    This was the mysterious bit I wanted to discuss after the rings.
    Looking back, I'm still not clear exactly how we were able to send Toria home.
    I mean, I'm assuming we successfully sent Toria home. And James did see a vision of her.
    But to be honest, given what we now know from the sixth ring, I am not at all sure why that worked.
    To be honest, we never completed an 11 circuit labyrinth in 2004.
    So I am, again, unsure exactly how we managed to send Toria home.


    Hopefully there won't be too many people at the wall at that time.
    It might be a little odd to see a flare.
    Or rather, to lose the minute of memory when the flare occurs.
    Which is what happened to us at Delphi.

    Yes, I hear you in San Francisco--
    and that is what I a saying, unfortunately. I feel we stumbled onto success but am still not sure why.
    I thought since Delphi was the site of the first omphalos...
    and you know, the agonothetia pledge has many references to "the first omphalos"...
    I can imagine, now, the allies walking some of the Great wall much as we walked the path at Delphi.
    It is a very specific path.


Apart from Eli, there should be 5 people who can tell us about that- Renata, Kentaro, and ? ? ?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:50 am
Last edited by jasper on Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:05 am; edited 1 time in total
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
Canzonett
Unfettered


Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 489
Location: Munich

Thanks Jasper, that was really helpful!

How are we to find out which of our six amnesiacs comes from a Gaea world originally? What do we know about their "personal labyrinth" experiences?

I also wonder why Eli persistently uses the first person PLURAL: "Which is what happened to US at Delphi" ... Does it simply refer to the agonothetai in general? Or is there more implied?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:00 am
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
unagi
Unfettered


Joined: 31 Mar 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Japan

Again I wonder why Ariadne said in her video "I'm not like the rest of them".

And I remember Theseus left Ariadne at Naxos in the Greek myth.

Is it well known why the dance is called Ariadne's dance?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:08 am
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
jasper
Unfettered


Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 560
Location: Texas

I guess I am thinking there are two different things that need to happen- and that the two don't effect each other. the 11 circuit wasn't performed in 2004 and Toria still was able to leave. I don't think the 11 circuit matters to traveling. I think it is the means for the 1 who is from here to find him or herself.

I hope that isn't redundant. I'll try asking Eli about that idea.

unagi wrote:
Again I wonder why Ariadne said in her video "I'm not like the rest of them".

And I remember Theseus left Ariadne at Naxos in the Greek myth.


good points! Ariadne is left behind in the myth. Smile

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:10 am
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
konamouse
Official uF Dietitian


Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 7822
Location: My own alternate reality

So Ariadne is the one who does the 11 circuit labryinth while the rest go to the wall?
_________________
'squeek'
r u a Sammeeeee? I am Forever!


PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:18 am
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
Canzonett
Unfettered


Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 489
Location: Munich

But then, she isn't Ariadne anymore - she's Alex now.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:19 am
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
jasper
Unfettered


Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 560
Location: Texas

konamouse wrote:
So Ariadne is the one who does the 11 circuit labryinth while the rest go to the wall?


Only, I think, if she is the one from here. She's pretty insistent that she's not "Aridane", though. She's Alex. Maybe that means one of the others is the Ariadne (the one from here.)

edit: err, what Canzonett said. Wink

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:21 am
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
unagi
Unfettered


Joined: 31 Mar 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Japan

I found doctors started calling her Ariadne. Hmmm....

Is it right to think the person who started TheO was left for the same reason?

By the way, if the omphalabyrinth is strong enough, can't we send home the remaining person separately? (And James, Renata, Kentaro ....)

EDIT: I found in the chat log Eli said they can.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 10:55 am
Last edited by unagi on Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:25 am; edited 1 time in total
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
Tenchizard
Decorated


Joined: 22 Sep 2007
Posts: 254

unagi wrote:

Is it right to think the person who started TheO was left for the same reason?

That's a point I've been thinking, which leads me to suspect Jorge was the one "left" here, and the one who did create Theo

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:18 pm
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
unagi
Unfettered


Joined: 31 Mar 2008
Posts: 464
Location: Japan

Tenchizard wrote:
unagi wrote:

Is it right to think the person who started TheO was left for the same reason?

That's a point I've been thinking, which leads me to suspect Jorge was the one "left" here, and the one who did create Theo

Oh, sorry ... I'd better read the chat log first ....

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:43 pm
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
jasper
Unfettered


Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 560
Location: Texas

I don't know if we can assume TheO started here. I thought it did, and I also thought it was just here, but Markus storyline suggests otherwise.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 2:57 pm
 View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
danteIL
Unfictologist


Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 1760

I thought it might be helpful to pull out the section of chat that talked about each bit. Here is the stuff about the "5 and 1", editing out all the bits about the video problems, etc. (I know it's still hard to read -- too much to format, sorry!):

Quote:
<EliHunt> "Five and one athletes" and "eleven by drawing" seem to me both unusual ways to characterize what must happen.
<Tenchizard> yes, five and one, is six, but not all six must do the same
<EliHunt> Tenchizard, that is my feeling as well.
<AUZ505> "Five and one" could be the Six
<Canzonett> The "one" made me think of Markus
<EliHunt> AUZ505, I agree with you that this refers to the six travelers. However, this is an unusual way to say "six".
<sparta247> or five and one referring to the rings we have and the 1 that's missing
<Canzonett> whom we lost to Theo for some time, but who might have a special role to fulfill ...
<lehall> I thought it might refer to an athlete who wanted to stay behind, and someone else taking their place
* Bookmore nods in agreement with Laura.
<Canzonett> Or could it be James?
<EliHunt> Sparta, I think it is clear that "five and one athletes" refers to six athletes, who must perform a task, as the code says...
<Tenchizard> Maybe... maybe the final labyrinth is not to be run by Six... maybe One person must stay
<EliHunt> But why "five and one"? Why not "six"? This is our first task, to understand this way of describing the six athletes.
<Canzonett> It signifies that one of them must go a part of his/her way alone, I guess.
<starlajo> in the oath we spoke it mentioned 'the one'
<EliHunt> LeHall, that is an interesting theory.
<Bookmore> EliHunt: Maybe because the 6 that came here, might not go back. Instead, 5 of the original group plus another one.
<EliHunt> We do know that one stayed behind in 1920.
<EliHunt> But why would one want to stay behind?
<Tenchizard> because he was already in his world?
<Bookmore> Question : Could it be that one of the 6 might HAVE to stay behind instead ?
<Nighthawk> It might be necessary for one to remain.
<Shad0> @EliHunt: Someone had speculated that the one who stayed behind founded the current TheO
<EliHunt> Shad0, yes, exactly, that is the basis for my understanding that one traveler stayed behind.
<lehall> I came to that idea because Alex talked about having destroyed her home world... she later had a vision in which her mother phoned her, but was still convinced that her own home was gone, and that an Alex existed in the other world - which couldn't hold two (so one would have to disappear)
<Shad0> Presumably because he/she disagreed with the mission of the agonothetai, much as the current TheO opposes us
<EliHunt> Did we determine which of the six that was?
<Canzonett> Kentaro?
<Shad0> For some reason, it's in my head that it was their Thumos.
<Shad0> @Canzonett: No, Kentaro was from the 2004 group
<sparta247> well I guess it makes sense for one to have to stay back to prepare the future team (tattoo, blindfold, etc.)
<Tenchizard> I have my theory, but I don't like it at all
<unagi1> Alex?
<lehall> I thought that the one who stayed behind might have been Jorge because he was from a Gaea world, which are both rare and prone to destruction
<CS> maybe five and one because only one is the runner?
<EliHunt> LeHall, yes, that was a disturbing vision for Alex, and there is still a high probability that she did witness her original home world experiencing the rapid continental shift.
<AUZ505> perhaps one has to stay back: The one from Gaea
<Tenchizard> because everything points to Jorge
<Canzonett> Jorge is the only one we know something substantial about ...
<Diego> how do we know which one is from Gaea?
<lehall> It says so in the Codex itself... I'll find the exact reference
<EliHunt> CS_Guest, this is interesting, although we know a labyrinth requires more wall than just 5.
<Shad0> @Diego: The Codex told us that Jorge was from Gaia.
* Bookmore thinks he might have a theory to explain the one staying behind.
<EliHunt> Bookmore, please share your theory!
<Diego> but which one of us 6 is from Gaea?
<Tenchizard> if Jorge was the leader then, only he could have the leadership to bould up Theo
<mrjudkins> Go ahead, yes!
<lehall> First part of chapter 19
<Bookmore> Let's see if I can put it in words.
<lehall> In English: "We did not meet anyone from our own parallel selves in this Gaea world. None of us would do that, except Jorge, who remembers his own home as a Gaea world."
<Bookmore> Originally, is it safe to assume that the 6 travelled from different words to ours?
<EliHunt> Also, if one must stay behind, do we know which one of the six it must be? I know some of the six are here, and I hope it does not disturb you to discuss this possibility.
<Canzonett> Maybe we should first ask who of the six WANT to get back?
<EliHunt> I realize both MeiHui and Diego have had visions of their home worlds. I do not want to upset you by discussing the possibility that one of you must stay behind, but we should at least prepare for that possibility if that is the prevailing theory.
<Bookmore> If it is the case, we could imagine that travelling from one world to another generates, let's say, a certain amount of disorder. If 6 people travel to one world from different worlds, this amount of "disorder" is spread between 6 different worlds.
<Diego> I need to go back to my baby !!! [my favorite line!!]
<Shad0> @EliHunt: Is it your thought that one of the six stayed behind in 1920, not simply because he/she opposed the agonothetai, but because one of the six MUST stay behind in order to send the other five home with someone else?
<EliHunt> Canzonett, yes. Markus has expressed some fear of returning to his world due to the fact that he may face repercussions from the members of Theo who sent him.
<Bookmore> However, 6 people travelling from a same world to their own might be too much "disorder" in one world for the fabric of the Worlds to cope with. Therefore the necessity for only 5 to leave...
<EliHunt> Alex has also expressed fear that she will wind up in a world that already has an Alex. Which would be... awkward.
<Diego> so Alex is from Gaea?
<lehall> Right... that's if she doesn't just disappear :\
<Canzonett> So, Alex and Markus might be potential "staying" candidates ...?
<EliHunt> Bookmore, I understand your theory. My reading of the Codex is that each of the travelers was from a different type of world.
<AUZ505> I guess, Alex
<CS> Theo can repercuss Markus from any world they choose, though.
<Canzonett> Bookmore: Sounds plausible.
<Bookmore> EliHunt: Then this might make sense.
<lehall> Also - and I don't mean to speculate about personal lives... but she's developed close relationships with people who stay here, hasn't she?
<EliHunt> Canzonett, I would say yes.
<Tenchizard> could it be that, when six are sent to a world, one of those six is already from that world, but looses his memory anyway?
<EliHunt> LeHall, it is true that if Alex stays she knows that both I and Kai will help her adjust to permanent residence.
<AUZ505> That's why Alex had so many visions of worlds where there was already a Alex. because Alex never left her world.
<EliHunt> AUZ505, yes, perhaps.
<Tenchizard> AUZ505: one can't go back to a world when they haven't left, right?
<Fencer> So if she never left our world, how did she lose her memory?
<EliHunt> So, we are discussing the peculiar phrasing of five and one.
<Bookmore> EliHunt: In the same way, the wear and tear could be spread between "travel sessions".
<Tenchizard> because losing the memory is like... the starting point?
<EliHunt> And our best theory is that one of the travelers may have to stay behind.
<AUZ505> Yes only five can go back. One is already on his world.
<EliHunt> Since we know one traveler originally stayed behind -- and wound up founding Theo.
<unagi1> Hmmm, considering that the six came to this world in the same way we are discussing, Moritz stayed behind.
<EliHunt> Let's think this through.
<Canzonett> And we're speculating about (1) who that original traveller might have been and (2) who might have to sty behind NOW
<EliHunt> If we choose one to stay behind, is that person de facto the runner for the final labyrinth?
<JamesMutters> that would make some sense
<EliHunt> I wonder how we are supposed to separate the five from the one.
<Canzonett> sounds plausible, since the labyrinth runner has a special role
<EliHunt> Roles in the most important game would be one way. Are there any other ideas?
<unagi1> So I think Thumos is the one who will stay behind, no?
<Bookmore> Canzonett: He does, but you don't run a labyrinth with only 5 walls, do you ?
<lehall> by choice, surely...
<Canzonett> on the other hand, all the amnesiacs obviously had been running labyrinths right before waking up in our world ...
<Bookmore> Well, unless it's tiny.
<Tenchizard> hmm... maybe, when the Six (or the Five, actually) are sent, someone has to be the "beacon", by running a labyrinth to summon them, and then the beacon loses his memory
<Bookmore> Tenchizard: However, so far it's people who *travelled* who lost their memory.
<Canzonett> That's another big question. How are we to build the walls of the final labyrinth?
<EliHunt> Bookmore, that is a good point.
<mrjudkins> Well - the runner ends up OUTSIDE of the labyrinth, don't they?
<EliHunt> perhaps there is another way to separate the five from the one?
<JamesMutters> would you do it by choice?
<EliHunt> I would hate to see everyone in the wall travel.
<Canzonett> By drawing?
<JamesMutters> indeed
<EliHunt> For instance, I dont' know that Kai wants to go to another parallel world!
<mrjudkins> True.
<Bookmore> Choice, drawing...
<CS> James and Eli- what happened last time?
<Bookmore> Or their ancient strength, maybe ?
<lehall> Does it have to do with their personal synchronization beforehand?
<lehall> or relative de-synch
<mrjudkins> Yes - how did Toria end up getting sent home?
<Canzonett> Maybe the wall of the final labyrinth must be blind as well as its runner
<EliHunt> CS-Guest, yes, that was the other enigma to ponder.
<EliHunt> We were able to send one runner home in 2004.
<Canzonett> Toria
<JamesMutters> I wasn't there, everyone left for athens, but then Toria didn't come back
<EliHunt> Despite the fact that our omphalos network was not complete.
<Bookmore> EliHunt: How did it occur ?
<AUZ505> So it could be that one of them has not lost his/her memory?
<sparta247> because of a lack of power in the omph knet?
<Shad0> @James: Were you present when Toria traveled in 2004?
<JamesMutters> @shad0, no I wasn't there
<EliHunt> Yes, we had a very weak strength in 2004, as there were hardly any agonothetai.
<Bookmore> EliHunt: Did Toria go through a labyrinth ? What was her role ?
<Shad0> @Eli, I don't suppose YOU were there when Toria traveled in 2004?
<Tenchizard> but... do you know how it happened? was the runner the one who travelled?
<EliHunt> James, are you following?
<JamesMutters> I'm following
<Tenchizard> or did the runner chose who would travel?
<JamesMutters> we're very interested to know what your side was
<EliHunt> Focus, Mr. Mutters, focus. Let me remind you this is your only chance to see Toria again.
<JamesMutters> I'm focussed
<Shad0> The Codex (chapter 23, for example) talks about a "door" -- is it possible that some sort of literal doorway opens, through which the traveler must physically step?
<meihui> maybe james is having second thought about seeing toria.. who knows
<EliHunt> All right, so leaving the five and one aside for now.


So I don't know if there was any big conclusion reached. It seemed to me that Eli was leaning toward Ariadne staying behind, which might make sense story-wise...

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:16 pm
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
Canzonett
Unfettered


Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 489
Location: Munich

The person who could definitely help us to find out more about what happened four years ago is Renata. Is there any way to contact her?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 5:25 pm
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
DavFlamerock
Entrenched


Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 936
Location: H2Oville, ME, USA

Okay I got this idea this morning but couldn't post it until now.

Five and One.

First off, all of the athletes are from other worlds--that's why they had amnesia. However, remember that Jorge remembered his world as another Gaia world.

Now here's the catch--something that has been suggested before but is an assumption--is that our world is the core or stem Gaia world, which is why it's so important that our world is the one they save. Anyway, assuming again that our world is the core Gaia world, then remember that Ariadne kept having visions of other worlds collapsing, worlds that her family lived, and remember that she kept saying that she couldn't return home...

Now imagine that Alex came from a Gaia world, and all the worlds she could return to are gone. Logically she'd want to return to a Gaia world... but if all the ones in which she lives are gone, then why not stay here?

Thus, the other 5 leave, and Alex remains.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 9:21 pm
 View user's profile Send private message
 Mark this and the following posts unread Back to top 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 1 of 3 [37 Posts]   Goto page: 1, 2, 3 Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic View previous topicMark the topic unreadView next topic
 Forum index » Archive » Archive: General » ARG: Find the Lost Ring
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
You cannot post calendar events in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group