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Brick
maskit wrote:
The only advice Vinny and Damien gave to searchers was in a May 2011 interview. They said people were looking too closely at every detail and not seeing the big picture.

That hint (which also said that it was necessary to sit down with a pen and paper in your hands) just confirmed to us that Mulligan's Clue of All Clues was that we should "retrace their steps" by drawing lines along their paths, which we expected to trace out some kind of image. This was one of the biggest red herrings we encountered.

maskit wrote:
Here’s how I read the Port of Cortland clue. Lots of people danced around it, but I never saw anyone post what I thought it meant. We are specifically supposed to be looking for the only NY subway station that has 5 of something in particular, the most of any station. Mulligan says the most he’s seen is 4, but the Captain reminds him of the Port of Cortland which has 5. I believe they are talking about transfer lines. There is only one station in NY with 5 transfer lines and that’s Times Square. You can transfer to 4 different lines there and if you walk through a tunnel you can access a fifth one at 42nd St /Port Authority. That is the one you can’t see.

I'll have to think more about your overall theory, but here is one detail that can be seen to corroborate your idea: In the scene that you are describing, Mulligan wins the debate with the Captain and is therefore shown to be an expert on ports. Therefore, one might also call him a port authority.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:25 pm
maskit
The only advice Vinny and Damien gave to searchers was in a May 2011 interview. They said people were looking too closely at every detail and not seeing the big picture.

You didn’t need every clue in Episode 1 to get to the subway station at Columbus Circle. In fact, you could have gotten there simply by solving the clues about the Maine Monument. Of course the final solution may prove every clue was needed for another purpose like a cipher, but right now it seems to me you didn’t need them all. That’s why I just kept coming back to Coney Island as being the big picture. Clue after clue pointed there. Well at least in my mind it did!

Here’s how I read the Port of Cortland clue. Lots of people danced around it, but I never saw anyone post what I thought it meant. We are specifically supposed to be looking for the only NY subway station that has 5 of something in particular, the most of any station. Mulligan says the most he’s seen is 4, but the Captain reminds him of the Port of Cortland which has 5. I believe they are talking about transfer lines. There is only one station in NY with 5 transfer lines and that’s Times Square. You can transfer to 4 different lines there and if you walk through a tunnel you can access a fifth one at 42nd St /Port Authority. That is the one you can’t see.

The lines are not the same as the colors or letters on the Subway trains, but instead the NAME of the line. The name has to do with the system it’s travelling on.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_New_York_City_Subway_transfer_stations

So the Port of Cortland is Times Square, but it is crossed out on the list shown in the episode, so I don’t think you were supposed to stop there. Mulligan is very intent on the most being 4. There are only 2 other stations with access to 4 separate lines.. Fulton Street and Coney Island/ Stillwell both have 4. They are currently building a tunnel to connect Fulton with Cortlandt Street which will then give Fulton 5.

I think the name “Port of Cortland” was made up by taking parts from the names of these 3 stations.. “Port” from Port Authority, “Cort” from Cortlandt and “land” from Coney Island.

Since the colors behind the pirates in Episode 3 is orange, orange, yellow, yellow, I again thought Mulligan was pointing us toward Coney Island, which has 2 orange subway and 2 yellow train services. Even though there are just 2 colors used there are actually 4 separate lines at Stillwell (BMT Brighton, IND Culver, BMT Sea Beach, and BMT West End).

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:59 pm
Badger
Sickshot,

I think that the NYT article said that they nailed a skull & crossbones to the tree about the spot to dig. I think that would have been enough to keep going until you hit something.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:02 pm
Sickshot
Another question I have is whether there is a clue that tells you how far down to dig.
In the picture in the NYT article the hole looked pretty deep. And I know they said all along that you'd KNOW when you got it, but it seems that the spot wasn't obviously marked like "dig here". What if someone gave up after getting a foot deep, which is feasible?
A clue telling you how deep could be the answer but I can't think of anything that would fit.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:33 pm
ccl28
Badger wrote:
Ep 3 ends in Brooklyn at the Atlantic Avenue Station (just after the yellow and orange lines cross the blue line).Captain is on the B line, Mulligan is on the D line, Crothers is on the N line, Tom is on the Q line. This mostly comes from the colored backgrounds around the characters. Tom and the Q line is a bit odd, but I think he starts at the Ninja star and catches up with the rest of the crew..


In my ep 5 thread, I say where I think everyone is:
http://forums.unfiction.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=32090

Captain - travelling SE on the B train near Coney Island
Mulligan - travelling SE on the D train near Coney Island
Crothers - travelling SE on the Q train near Coney Island
Black Tom - Travelling W (not E) on the A/C train near the Hoyt Station
Parrot - Dropped off the D train somewhere in Brooklyn

I think Tom is heading west because glove and boots were heading west when he joins them. It seems to work with my bus routes for Ep5:

BLACK TOM'S PATH
I am going to begin with Black Tom's path because it is the easiest one. The only hard part is realizing that he was travelling west on the blue line and not east. To associate a clue to Black Tom, you look for changes to his cards, chip stack, percent chance of winning, chip total (when he makes a bet), or commentator remarks during his turn.

TOM CLUE 1:
Tom is dealt a JJ. The 'J' is for the Jay Street Station.

TOM CLUE 2:
When Tom bets at the flop, the chip total becomes $2,734. Centered above the '2' is a '6' of spades. Read this as 62. Tom takes the 62 bus.

TOM CLUE 3:
Tom turns his JJ into QQ and his % to win goes to 69%. He gets on the 69 bus.

TOM CLUE 4:
When Tom changes his JJ to QQ, the commentator says "He traded his jacks for queens." The B62 intersects the Q69 at Jackson Ave and Queens Blvd. These types of confirmations are are all over ep 5. Until you find them, it's possible you are completely off track.

The Q69 may be the last bus for Tom in this episode. The Q69 passes by Hell Gate. Perhaps he took the Q100 (his % to win goes to 100% when he wins). It's also possible that he takes the Q69 to St. Michael's Cemetery. I believe St Michaels is the cemetery in ep6. St Michael is archangel Michael and the cemetery in ep6 has a statue of the archangel Michael.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:50 am
Badger
Ep 3 ends in Brooklyn at the Atlantic Avenue Station (just after the yellow and orange lines cross the blue line).Captain is on the B line, Mulligan is on the D line, Crothers is on the N line, Tom is on the Q line. This mostly comes from the colored backgrounds around the characters. Tom and the Q line is a bit odd, but I think he starts at the Ninja star and catches up with the rest of the crew.

In Ep 5, it gets fuzzy for me, but I think that the Captain takes the B to the end of the line, then turns back north on the Q and gets off at Neck Ave or Ave U (Lady Luck has hit the end of the line and turned back the other way. I'm up to my collar (neck) in turds). It's plausible that the characters wind up at different Ave U stations on different lines - but that's just a guess.

However, the announcer names clearly take you to Ave U & Flatbush Ave.

My guess is that Ep 6 doesn't tell you anything, really. I bet that the commissioned the comic book with clues to get you to Ave U and Flatbush, and then later edited the script to move some of these clues into Ep 5. That is, I think production changes made Ep 6 redundant. (I thinks I'm am stupider than I was before).

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:38 am
ccl28
I'm less interested in fitting certain clues to the final location. I want to know the progression from ep3 onward. Clearly, we got episodes 1&2. Ep 3 is where everyone starts to diverge. There must be 100 clues here. I want to know step-by-step how they fit together.

IMO, the Cybele clue is completely useless. There is like 3 degrees of separation to figure that one out. Almost anything works at that point. I have a feeling that if you followed the clues throughout the series, then you end up at FBF with 100% confidence. That is the way this would have been solved.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 9:51 am
Badger
Maskit,

Wow! That was awesome!

Other than the flying birdy, I got nothing else to fit with Ep 8 at FBF, and precious little with Ep 7. So I totally understand how people made those clues fit better at other locations. (see my posts about GA Plaza).

I'm a bit fuzzy on where Mulligan and Crothers go in Episode 5, but I think that they did go to Coney Island before bouncing north again. Maybe, the Aquarium. In Ep 6, the cover of the comic book shows Mulligan holding a red and white stripe cup that looks a lot like the Astro Tower. I think that the Captain just hits the end of the B train and turns around to go back up to Neck St. Tom may be with him on the Q train.

But I'm certain that the sequence of names (Winona) that the announcers use in Ep 5 match the streets that take you from Ocean Ave to Henriksen / Flatbush Ave along Ave U. They confirm that with their sign off Leslie Sebastian Charles (Billy Ocean's birth name) and Hal Vukovich (the name of the character Lance Henriksen plays in Terminator). The comic book snake and the Capn's giant turtle are features in a playground along Ave U, and the Vitamin Shoppe (don't eat those vitamins) is a block north of Ave U. Too much stuff for it to just be coincidence.

Then Ep 4 tells you to go 3.5 miles and turn around cuz you've gone too far. Presumably that's gotta be in a straightish line, which you can only do on Flatbush Ave. "Don't eat those vitamins" may tell you to not go north in the direction of the Vitamin Shoppe. 3.5 miles south takes you past FBF and just over the Gil Hodges Bridge. So if you are on the bus, turn around and go one stop back north. That puts you at the entrance to FBF.

In Ep 4, Tom's first clue should be Clue 40. The Japanese characters say "North Section." "North Forty" actually just means North Section. If you move Tom's clue to the next Episode (Ep 7 in this case), then this puts you in the North Forty Woods of FBF in Ep 7. I didn't think to move Tom's clue and as a result I was too quick (i.e., searched only twice in 3 trips to FBF) to give up on the North Forty Woods (because the order seemed odd). I think that if I had thought of that, we would have kept searching those woods. As it was, we actually did do some digging 250 ft from the Crows Nest (Model Airplane Control Tower). But that wasn't the ship and we missed the clue about it being 250 Captains feet. I doubt that I ever would have gotten the Fir Tree = ship clue, but if we searched long enough I think we would have seen the skull and crossbones.

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 9:17 am
maskit
Even though the treasure was found 4 miles away, I am still convinced the hunt was all about Coney Island. It’s not just the many clues that led there, but I think it was the overall point to the story itself. To me, Tutty symbolized the Coney Island of the past-the good times. His red and white striped shirt (like the Astro Tower) with the word “happy” on it says it all. The Captain wanted to keep his memories safe, unchanged and locked away. Crothers represented the sad reality of the gradual destruction of CI over the years particularly due to uncaring developers (like Thor Equities) who want to tear it all down. This is why his body parts keep getting chopped off until there is hardly anything left. The burning of his hat was a symbol of the historic fires that have destroyed large parts of the amusement area, such as the huge 1911 blaze in Dreamland. Crothers/Parrot is the combination of Tutty (the past) and Crothers (the present) or the way it is now. In the end, the Captain finally accepts this combination and realizes that even though something is smaller and very much changed, it can still have an intact heart and spirit. The Captain actually mentions merchants and getting drunk in one of his final speeches about Crothers/Parrot’s smallness. I think he is talking about the few remaining businesses on the Boardwalk.

I also saw the Tutty/potato clue as another confirmer for Coney Island. In Asser/Levy Park there is an historic band shell that developers want to tear down and replace with a very glitzy wavy-roofed stage. The many people who are horrified by this refer to the proposed building as the “potato chip’. Replace Tutty (the old days) with a potato.

In the beginning of the final episode the Captain says:

I am talkin' now to the spirik world. That world filled with souls, and demons, and black-hearted oozin' buggers what make decent living-type folk puke up at the sight of yez.”

I think he is referring to the Ghost Hole ride on 12th street. between the Bowery and the Boardwalk. This ride has a façade full of scary figurines and murals, plus (this is my favorite part) directly in front facing the spooky images is a rather infamous lifesize animatronic human figure in a large plexiglas box that does nothing but throw up all day long.

About a block away on 12th and Surf is a large sign for a game that is no longer there. It has ghosts on it and the words “shoot em”. I think these are Mulligan’s “ghosts that can’t be shot”.

If the Captain and Mulligan are both on 12th street in Coney Island at the beginning of the final episode, I’m not sure how they get to Floyd Bennett Field by the end of it. It is not too far away though. Of course, I realize I could completely wrong and they aren’t there at all.

But seriously, the mannequin is looking at ghosts and throwing up. How could the captain be talking about any other place? I just can’t let go of it, yet. Well, not until I hear the final true solution!

PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:19 am
ccl28
tesoromio2010 wrote:
Perhaps people failed to find the treasure, but this was no failure. This is an amazing ending to a very enjoyable adventure. Smile


The hunt was a failure by definition. Nobody found the treasure and nobody ever will. The donation was the right thing to do.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:30 pm
tesoromio2010
Perhaps people failed to find the treasure, but this was no failure. This is an amazing ending to a very enjoyable adventure. Smile

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:21 pm
imanygirl
birdie
plane

My initial thought that the "flying birdie" was a plane, but how to follow it's path is what threw me for a loop. Follow the plane TO the airport or AWAY from the airport? So then I thought maybe it was a golf thing, but that went nowhere too. Then I thought it was the ride, The Soaring Eagle, at Coney Island, but found out that it was built after the hunt started so I went back to planes but wasn't sure how it fit in.

Now I understand the "wood on top" as being trees, but at first I thought it was like the boardwalk or a wooden ramp or something.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:41 am
ccl28
I should also say this. I totally agree with all the decisions these guys made after the hurricane. However, they should have given out more clues as interest faded over a year ago. The treasure hunt was a failure, even though some good came of it.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:15 am
ccl28
*

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:09 am
imanygirl
Good article
my thoughts

George_Kaplan_ wrote:
well now that this is "solved" ...

where I was at was Coney Island .. thought for certain "The Crows Nest" was The Parachute Jump on the Coney Island boardwalk

had a feeling the chest was "buried" either under the boardwalk or on one of the abandoned boats in Coney Island Creek , one of the "ghost ships" ... apparently it was not.

I look forward to the explanation of the clues. I look forward to majority of us looking at the solve presented by the puppeteers and saying things to the effect of "well what about..." and "really thats it" ..and "so that homage wasnt a clue at all", "a skull & crossbones nailed to a tree? you cant be serious" ... etc.

I thought for certain there would be a final "payoff" episode (post The Seance) ... that would have aired which would show the pirates making the solve , apparently I was wrong. I would have thought THAT would have been their payoff, where we could have all had that OHHHHH moment and the entire "story" would have unfolded and come together, that's how I would have booked it at least.

The immediate question that I have is ... if this treasure was legit buried in the ground in Floyd Bennett Field as the puppeteers have stated (where they dug it up with The NY Times present) ... how would they 'know' if someone had dug it prior?



That's where I was convinced it was, until recently, where I was moving further north towards the Fencing Academy (FA) and Coney Island Farms (FA) = FAFA, the beaver/woodchuck/groundhog.

Anyway, I'm the one that took the photo of the empty chest and posted it on the Facebook group. I spoke to the reporter yesterday, but he didn't tell me it was solved at first. He patiently listened to all my theories, which I think is funny now. He was a really nice guy.

The ironic thing is that I took the photo of the empty chest in Far Rockaway and that's where the money ended up going! It is a little sad that the hunt had to end this way- with them digging it up- but I'm glad it went to a good cause.

I think they made the videos too long for most people's attention span and because you had to watch them all more than once, it just wasn't realistic to get that many people to follow for very long. I gave up several times because it's extremely time consuming. It was a good idea though and I wish they'd do something like that again, but with shorter videos or just one video or something.

And I'm totally with you- I really hope they do offer more of an explanation of the clues and release a final video. To leave it as is would be really unfair to all of us who spent so much time trying to solve the puzzle.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:56 am
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